Global Art History - INDA - Response #2

Page 4 of 4 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

Go down

Respone

Post  Phuripop Paisalsak on Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:22 am

In chapter 3 and 4, the writer talks more on nakedness. According to what I’ve read women are more likely to be target for a subject of nudity because women have more expressive presence such as gestures, voice, opinions, expressions, clothes, chosen surroundings, tastes. Almost everything that women do gives them a good look on their appearance. Women emotion is also a good example of attractiveness as when they expressing their anger or happiness and on how they would like to be treating by the other. Moreover the artists chose to draw nude women to be their models because of their sexual desire for example “you paint the naked women because you enjoy looking at her” (p.51). Most artists have their one message hidden behind their work for instance “a mirror”, a mirror often used as a symbol to represent vanity of women (p.51).

On the other hand, men are likely to be target as a model for nudity since men only express power.


Phuripop Paisalsak

Posts : 3
Join date : 2011-08-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Response

Post  Guntana on Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:23 am

I, again, do agree with some of the above responds, and do disagree against some.

In the beginning of chapter 3 of the book Ways of seeing, the author explains about how men and women were differently viewed at the period of time.

“A woman must continually watch herself. She is almost continually accompanied by her own image of herself (46).” According to the passage, I do not think what Berger wanted to communicate was an inequality between men and women as Chayothorn wrote on his comment. It was how the women in the era had been taught to take care of themselves and to make themselves be worth to be treated nicely as we are able to see form the quote, “She has to survey everything she is and everything she does because how she appears to the others, and ultimately how she appears to men, is of crucial importance for what is normally thought of as the success of her life (46).” Moreover, from the saying, “Men survey women before treating them. Consequently how a woman appears to a man can determine how she will be treated (46),” I can clearly understand that it is not only men who survey to choose a woman, but also they, women, decide to appear well to be surveyed by men. They also do choose.

Next, it focuses on the differences between nudity and nakedness. From the book The nude by Kenneth Clark, he maintains that “to be naked is simply to be without clothes, whereas the nude is a form of art. (53)” I noticed that nudity is much more complicated than just to get naked. As the story of Adam and Eve has been written on page 47 and 48, the couple noticed that they were naked and started to feel ashamed because the apple tree made them wise.

Does that mean we need to be stupid enough to get rid of nakedness to see nudity?

I still cannot get it.

Berger, J. Ways of seeing. London: British Broadcasting Corporation. 1972.

Guntana

Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-08-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

response to "ways of seeing" chp 3-4

Post  Thida J. on Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:24 am

What do you see in women? Naked or nudity? From what I understand, the difference between them is that naked is the beauty of women figure while nudity is the erotic expression that women express to men. As stated in the book, “to be nude is to be seen naked by others and yet now organized for oneself. A naked body has to be seen as and object in order to become a nude. Nakedness reveals itself. Nudity is places on display.” (p.54) I am absolutely agree with this since I also see woman perfectly naked are seem to be more classical and are more artistically expressed, which woman with pieces of clothes are more sexually express and are not as classical as naked.
Not to forget, the book have also mentioned about woman as an object not only by the men but also by themselves.
Berger, John. Ways of Seeing. London: British Broadcasting Corporation, 1972. Print.

Thida J.

Posts : 4
Join date : 2011-08-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Response Chapter 3-4

Post  Sethavudh on Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:24 am

The nudity are accepted as an art, Only the beauty of women that is approved in social."A woman must continually watch herself, She is almost continually accompanied by her own image of herself" (p.46). According from this statement it's clearly that women became more aware of her appearances, and also connected to reveal about relationship of men and women.

"The first nudes in the tradition depicted Adam and Eve"(p.47). Supported by the fact that "human were born naked". The way i think about naked is the beauty comes with the body, Clothes are just an accessory that's why there are multi-perspectives about this such as art, sexual, traditional, etc."Clothes encumber contact and movement but it would seem that nakedness has a positive visual value in its own right"(P.58). According from the text, nakedness can provokes a strong sense of human instinct. I agree that with these nakedness it can easily to seducing human, Which later we can see very often appearing of homosexual. In conclusion, Today the attitudes and values of naked and nude are expressed more widely and differently. But it can't change the fact that nudity or what we call art is the greatest seducing item.



Berger,J. (1972).Way of Seeing.British Broadcasting Corporation and Penguin Books Ltd.

Sethavudh

Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-08-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Chapter 3-4 - Kanin Sunthornsuk

Post  Kanin Sunthornsuk on Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:44 am

After Reading Chapter 3-4 ,I summarized some of the Idea in those chapters.The book begins with show how Woman's presence different from Man's.So Women do thing implicitly to show how they want to be treated while men do things pretty outspokenly.this is kind of true and happen in many cultures."She comes to consider the surveyor and the surveyed within her as the two constituent yet always distinct elements of her identity as women"(p.46)"

Then,the book show traditional first nudes "Adam and Eve".In That point of time ,Women is weaker sex due to in Christianity too."Woman is blamed and is punished by being made subservient to the man in relation to woman,the man becomes the agent of God"(p.48).In that time,Mostly men are the painter so there's no surprise that women are the model.It is kind of ironic That in Christian's culture would prefer that women preserve ones purity and save their virginity.In The Christianity Art,Most of the women were nude.But,maybe the breasts are acceptable. like in nowadays movie ,women's breasts are more acceptable to be appear in movie.

“To be naked is to be oneself. To be nude is to be seen naked by others and yet not recognized for oneself. A naked body has to be seen as an object in order to become a nude” (p.54).I recognize that Most women in nude painting were posing like in the book written,their eyes contact to viewer or the they pose not naturally but pose to be watched as it is considered to be called nude not naked.

"She is not naked as she is. She is naked as the spectator sees her"(p.50).This quote imply that painter may exaggerate the women's body to be that painter would think beautiful or what painter would like to be.

After I watched those image in book, I recognize that the women in painting were kind of fleshy and had very pale and glowing skins.Maybe in that point of time, that is the Idea of beauty .

Berger , John . Ways of Seeing . London : British Broadcasting Corporation, 1972. Print. study


Kanin Sunthornsuk

Posts : 3
Join date : 2011-08-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

global art history response

Post  Rossarin on Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:00 am

In the first two chapters, Berger already explained about people see things differently. So in chapter 3 it was not surprising that he mention about how we view the ideal of men and women differently also as he stated, “A man’s presence is dependent upon the promise of power which he embodies.”(p.45) And in contrast with woman “a Woman’s presence expresses her own attitude to herself, and defines what can and cannot be done to her”(p.46). I do agree with the inequality of men and women even though nowadays the society said everyone are equal but in the deepest mind women are still not equal to men. This can also be seen in the bible “woman is blamed and is punished by being made subservient to man”(p.48)

“Men survey women before treating them. Consequently how a woman appears to a man can determine how she will be treated”(p.46) As the value of woman in society is judged by their appearance unlike men that judge by the action, “men act and women appear”(p.47) This also show the unfair of men and women.

“The nude is condemned to never being naked”(p.54) In my opinion, this is true and as Berger mentioned in the sentence “To be naked is to be oneself. To be nude is to be seen naked by others and yet recognized for oneself.”(p.54) So that nude and naked are not the same “To be naked is simply to be without clothes, whereas the nude is a form of art”(p.53)

“The painters and spectator- owners were usually men and the persons treated as objects, usually women.”(p.63) This also supported the idea of unequal relationship. Why artist painted women not men? This is because men are the spectator.

Rossarin

Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-08-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 4 of 4 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum